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Pre-Adamic Creation

CoreIssue

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The Hebrew definitions, etc, strudy tools are provided in the Category Study Resources.

When people crack open the Bible, the most common assumption accepted by Christians is that all matter and energy came into existence within the six days in chapter one of Genesis, thus meaning the earth is merely thousands of years old.

The statement itself is flawed. The Bible does not state the Earth is thousands of years old. This statement comes from the assumption that the six days of creation begin at Genesis 1:1.

This is incorrect. They begin at Genesis 1:3.
Genesis 1:1:
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Bara'
Strong's Number: 1254
Original WordWord Origin
arba primitive root
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
Bara'TWOT - 278
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
baw-raw' Verb
Definition
1. to create, shape, form
a. (Qal) to shape, fashion, create (always with God as subject)
1. of heaven and earth
2. of individual man
3. of new conditions and circumstances
4. of transformations​
b. (Niphal) to be created
1. of heaven and earth
2. of birth
3. of something new
4. of miracles​
c. (Piel)
1. to cut down
2. to cut out​
2. to be fat
a. (Hiphil) to make yourselves fat​
The Hebrew word, bara, in Genesis 1:1, indicates that what was created was "ex-nihilo" - out of nothing. One should not confuse bara (“he created”) with its synonym `asah (“he made”). In the nothingness, there was only God.

For examples of “made,” consider Exodus 20:11 and Exodus 31:17.
Exodus 20:11:
For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day.
`asah
Strong's Number: 6213
Original WordWord Origin
hX[a primitive root
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
`asahTWOT - 1708,1709
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
aw-saw' Verb
Definition
Strong's Number: 06213; TWOT: 1708,1709; verb
1. to do, fashion, accomplish, make
a. (Qal)
1. to do, work, make, produce 1a​
b. to do 1a
c. to work 1a
d. to deal (with) 1a
e. to act, act with effect, effect
1. to make 1a​
f. to make 1a
g. to produce 1a
h. to prepare 1a
i. to make (an offering) 1a
j. to attend to, put in order 1a
k. to observe, celebrate 1a
l. to acquire (property) 1a
m. to appoint, ordain, institute 1a
n. to bring about 1a
o. to use 1a
p. to spend, pass
q. (Niphal)
1. to be done
2. to be made
3. to be produced
4. to be offered
5. to be observed
6. to be used​
r. (Pual) to be made
2. (Piel) to press, squeeze
Therefore, there is a fundamental difference between God creating, forming, and shaping the heavens and the earth [Bara' in Genesis 1:1] compared to God making, fashioning, and working the heavens and the earth [`asah in Exodus 20:11 and Exodus 31:17].

For the definition of these words “made” and “create,” I will turn to the Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, Tenth Edition:
Made:
(1): (a): FICTITIOUS, INVENTED (b): artificially produced (c): put together of various ingredients
(2): assured of success​
1Create:
(1): to bring into existence <God created the heaven and the earth--Genesis 1:1 (AV)>
(2): (a): to invest with a new form, office, or rank (b): to produce or bring about by a course of action or behavior
(3): CAUSE, OCCATION (4): (a): to produce through imaginative skill (b): DESIGN ~ vi: to make or bring into existence something new"​
Again, notice the key difference between (made) "put together of various ingredients" verses (create) "to bring into existence." The term "made" used in the context of "create" is inaccurate, by definition.​
Genesis 1:1-2
Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
Hayah
Strong's Number: 01961
Original WordWord Origin
hyha primitive root [compare (01933)]
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
HayahTWOT - 491
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
haw-yaw Verb
Definition
to be, become, come to pass, exist, happen, fall out
1. (Qal)
a. to happen, fall out, occur, take place, come about, come to pass
b. to come about, come to pass
c. to come into being, become
d. to arise, appear, come
e. to become
f. to become
g. to become like
h. to be instituted, be established
i. to be
j. to exist, be in existence
k. to abide, remain, continue (with word of place or time)
l. to stand, lie, be in, be at, be situated (with word of locality)
m. to accompany, be with​
2. (Niphal)
a. to occur, come to pass, be done, be brought about
b. to be done, be finished, be gone​
Tohuw
Strong's Number: 08414
Original WordWord Origin
whtfrom an unused root meaning to lie waste
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
TohuwTWOT - 2494a
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
to'-hoo Noun Masculine
Definition
1. formlessness, confusion, unreality, emptiness
a. formlessness (of primeval earth)
1. nothingness, empty space​
b. that which is empty or unreal (of idols) (fig)
c. wasteland, wilderness (of solitary places)
d. place of chaos
e. vanity
Bohuw
Strong's Number:
0922
Original WordWord Origin
whbfrom an unused root (meaning to be empty)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
BohuwTWOT - 205a
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
bo'-hoo Noun Masculine
Definition
  1. emptiness, void, waste
T@howm
Strong's Number: 08415
Original WordWord Origin
~whtfrom (01949)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
T@howmTWOT - 2495a
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
teh-home' Noun
Definition
  1. deep, depths, deep places, abyss, the deep, sea
    1. deep (of subterranean waters)
    2. deep, sea, abysses (of sea)
    3. primeval ocean, deep
    4. deep, depth (of river)
    5. abyss, the grave
God created the earth to be inhabited.
Isaiah 45:18:
For this is what the LORD says--
he who created the heavens,
he is God;
he who fashioned and made the earth,
he founded it;
he did not create it to be empty,
but formed it to be inhabited--
But, in Genesis 1:2, the earth was empty. Further, an empty, chaotic [Tohuw] wasteland [Bohuw] in water [T@howm] is not conditions a human civilization can live in.

God’s works are perfect.
Deuteronomy 32
4 He is the Rock, his works are perfect,
and all his ways are just."
Therefore, God would have created a perfect earth in Genesis 1:1.

But, in Genesis 1:2, the earth was an empty, chaotic [Tohuw] wasteland [Bohuw] in water [T@howm]. This is not perfection, but the opposite.

Further, God is omnipotent—meaning he can do exactly what he wants without limitation. Therefore, God does not need to create a formless and void earth and then mold it from there, which would imply God has limits and gets tired. Clear academic logic says he can create a perfect earth and perfect universe in one, definitive act.

In addition, Scripture shows that creation was one, definitive act:
Psalm 33
6 By the word of the LORD were the heavens made,
their starry host by the breath of his mouth.
9 For he spoke, and it came to be;
he commanded, and it stood firm.
Also, God would have created any inhabitants [company, not race] perfect [perfect physical beings] as well.

God would have no reason to create darkness in his original creation, for there is no darkness in him.

1 John 1
5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.
Further, God himself emits light. And since he would have no reason to create darkness in his original creation [1 John 1:5], he would have let it shine on his creation.

In Revelation 22:5, of the New Jerusalem it says, "There will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light."

Thus, God’s own light would have illuminated his creation.

Next, look at Job 38:6, where God asks Job about creation of earth to make a point:
"On what were its footings set,
or who laid its cornerstone--
while the morning stars sang together
and all the angels shouted for joy?"
Clearly, this speaks of angels singing while the creation was completed.

When Lucifer ("light bringer") was created, he was the most powerful guardian cherub who guarded God's thrown. However, he became power hungry and wanted to rule heaven himself.

In Ezekiel 28:12-17, when God is giving prophesies against the King of Tyre, God uses Lucifer as an example, saying:
12 "Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: You were a model of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden, the garden of God;
every precious stone adorned you:
ruby, topaz and emerald,
chrysolite, onyx and jasper,
sapphire, turquoise and beryl.
Your settings were made of gold;
on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for so I ordained you.
You were on the holy mount of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
15 You were blameless in your ways
from the day you were created
till wickedness was found in you.
16 Through your widespread trade
you were filled with violence,
and you sinned.
So I drove you in disgrace
from the mount of God,
And I expelled you, O guardian cherub,
from among the fiery stones.
17 Your heart became proud
on account of your beauty,
and you corrupted your wisdom
because of your splendor;”
These verses are clearly not speaking of the king of Tyre because:
1) He was not perfect [verse 12], but only human.
2) He was not in the Garden of Eden [verse 13].
3) He is not a cherub [verse 14].
4) He did not walk the mount of God [verse 14].
5) He did not walk the mount of God, so he could not be driven from it [verse 16].​
Ezekiel 28
14 “You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for so I ordained you.
You were on the holy mount of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.”
Note: The term "fiery stones" most likely refers to the Seraphim [ref. "Seraph," meaning "to burn"] who guarded God's throne while Lucifer guarded God's throne as a powerful "capstone" of a protective formation, or "structure" [ref. Isaiah 6:1-8; Ezekiel 1:1-28]. Hence, the terminology of "walk[ing] among the fiery stones" means "walking among the Seraphim."

Lucifer wanted to be higher than God. In Isaiah 14:12-15 God related the king of Babylon to Lucifer and his fall, while talking to Isaiah:
12 "How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!

13 You said in your heart,
'I will ascend into heaven;
I will raise my throne above the stars of God;
I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly,
on the utmost heights of the sacred mountain.
14 I will ascend above the tops of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.'
15 But you are brought down to the grave,
to the depths of the pit."
The significance of the "morning star(s)" is clearly that of angels created in the original creation, as referred to in Job 38:6.

These verses cannot refer to the king of Babylon because the king did not ascend from the earth in order to be cast down [verse 12].
Isaiah 14:12:
"How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!”
Heylel
Strong's Number: 1966
Original WordWord Origin
llyhfrom (01984) (in the sense of brightness)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
HeylelTWOT - 499a
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
hay-lale' Noun Masculine
Definition
Lucifer = "light-bearer"
1. shining one, morning star, Lucifer
a. of the king of Babylon and Satan (fig.)​
2. 'Helel' describing the king of Babylon
Then Lucifer led one third of the angels in Heaven in his rebellion.
Revelation 12:3-4
Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and seven horns and seven crowns on his heads. His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth.
Given the verse of Job 38:6, with the "stars" singing together, and Satan as the "dragon," and the flinging of stars to the earth by the "dragon's tail" (Satan’s act), it is clear that a third of the angels followed Satan and where cast down with him.
Revelation 12:7
And there was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back.
Lucifer (Satan) was defeated and cast down.
Revelation 12:8-9
But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
In Luke 10:18, Jesus, the Son of God himself said, "I saw Satan fall like lightening from heaven."
In Isaiah 14:12, God said:
"How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
The significance of the "morning star(s)" is clearly that of angels created in the original creation, as referred to in Job 38:6.

A key observation in Isaiah 14:12 is that Lucifer "laid low" the nations. For the context and meaning of laid low, consider the following the following verses:

Isaiah 25:12, where Isaiah says:
“He will bring down your high fortified walls
and lay them low;
he will bring them down to the ground,
to the very dust.”
Job 14:10, where Job says:
“But man dies and is laid low;
he breathes his last and is no more.”
And Psalm119:25, where Daleth sings:
“I am laid low in the dust;
renew my life according to your word.”
Clearly, by these verses, the definition and context of laid low is usually destroying, defeating, putting down, etc. Thus, Lucifer, who once defeated, destroyed, put down, etc. nations was himself put down and humiliated before the nations and kings that knew who he was and what he did.]

In Ezekiel 28:17-19, God continues:
17 So I threw you to the earth;
I made a spectacle of you before kings.
18 By your many sins and
dishonest trade
you have desecrated your sanctuaries.
So I made fire come out of you,
and it consumed you,
and I reduced you to ashes
on the ground
in the sight of all who were watching.
19 All the nations who knew you
are appalled at you;
You have come to a horrible end
and will be no more.
In conjunction with the content of Ezekiel 28:12-17 pointed out, these verses cannot refer to the king of Tyre because:
  • He never ascended from the earth, so he could not be thrown down [verse 17].
  • God never set the person of the king of Tyre on fire [past tense] [verse 18].]

Notice the reference to “nations” and “all who were watching.” This is a clear illusion to the perfect physical beings that inhabited the earth. Further, the fallen Lucifer was humiliated before them.

As Lucifer and his followers were cast down, God, out of great anger, followed them and directed great wrath towards them and the perfect beings on earth that rebelled as well.
Psalm 18
7 The earth trembled and quaked,
and the foundations of the mountains shook;
they trembled because he was angry
8 Smoke rose from his nostrils;
consuming fire came from his mouth,
burning coals blazed out of it.
9 He parted the heavens and came down;
dark clouds were under his feet.
10 He mounted the cherubim and flew;
he soared on the wings of the wind.
11 He made darkness his covering, his canopy around him--
The dark rain clouds in the sky.
12 Out of the brightness of his presence clouds advanced,
with hailstones and bolts of lightening.
13 The LORD thundered from heaven;
the voice of the Most High resounded.
14 He shot his arrows and scattered the enemies,
great bolts of lightening and routed them.
15 The valleys of the sea were exposed
and the foundations of the earth laid bare
at your rebuke, O LORD,
at the blast of breath from your nostrils.
Psalm Chapter 18's subject is David's persecution by Saul and others and the fact that God delivered him from the situation. The subject then is really God's judgment on the enemies which resulted in David's deliverance:
  • Verses 1-3 - His devotion and trust in the Lord
  • Verses 4-5 - David encounters a death crisis
  • Verse 6 - But he trusts in God for deliverance
  • Verses 16-19 - David records the Lord's deliverance from his enemies and from the death crisis.
But in verses 7-15 - we have a record of God's judgment in a different situation.Here, the language changes totally. Here there is no mention of people. Here one must look beyond David's life to find the reference. Even if one were to symbolize the passage as a whole, it can find no correlation to David's deliverance.

Notice God is attacking "enemies." If Lucifer and the angels that followed him were defeated and being cast down, then who was God directing his offensive wrath [“arrows and lightening”] towards? Logic says the perfect beings on earth rebelling against God.

Look at Job as well:
Job 26
11 The pillars of the heavens quake,
aghast at his rebuke."
Job 9
5 He moves the mountains without their knowing it
and overturns them in his anger.
He shakes the earth from its place
and makes its pillars tremble.
After God came down from heaven and unleashed his wrath, he observed the devastation and hovered in the position that it is in on Genesis 1:2.
Jeremiah 4
23 I looked at the earth, and it was formless and empty;
and at the heavens, and their light was gone.
24 I looked at the mountains, and they were quaking;
all the hills were swaying.
25 I looked, and there were no people;
every bird in the sky had flown away.
26 I looked, and the fruitful land was a desert;
All its towns lay in ruins before the LORD,
before his fierce anger.
The unique past tense phraseology "formless and empty" within the future tense phraseology in Jeremiah 4 is the key. This is a reference to a different time in the past that God had seen firsthand.

"All [the earth’s] towns lay in ruins” and “there were no people.” This indicates total destruction of civilization and total absence of physical beings. Further, “every bird in the sky had flown away,” indicating all birds had died, or been wiped out.
At no point in human history has all people or any animals had been wiped out by God.

Therefore, it could only apply to the "formless and empty" state in Genesis 1:2.

After Lucifer and his angels were cast down [Revelation 12:8-9, In Luke 10:18, Ezekiel 28:17-19, Isaiah 14:12] and God’s wrath towards the earth [Psalm 18:7-15, Jeremiah 4:23, Job 9:5, Job 26:1] was finished, the earth was in the state described in Genesis 1:2 [Psalm 18:15]. One can logically deduce that the perfect physical beings who had rebelled against God were killed and their spirits roamed free [Psalm 18:14].

Because of the failed rebellion, Lucifer [Ezekiel 28:15-16] and the angels that followed him [Revelation 12:3-4] had brought sin down to the earth [Ezekiel 28:17, Revelation 12:9]. And the sight of sin disgusted God, so he clothed it in darkness to hide it from his view.

Looking at Job 38:9, where God questions Job about the creation of earth to make a point:
Who shut up the sea behind doors
when it burst forth from the womb,
when I made the clouds its garment
and wrapped it in thick darkness,
when I fixed limits for it
and set its doors and bars in place,
Also, Psalms 8:3:
When I consider your heavens,
the work of your fingers,
the moon and the stars,
which you have set in place,
Also remember that in Jeremiah 4:23 the heavens had “lost their light,” so the darkness was consuming creation. God then reformatted the darkness into the heavens above earth.

The angels that followed Lucifer and were cast down were bound by chains and placed in a dark place when God recreated the earth beginning in Genesis 1:3.
Jude 1
6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home--these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.
In 2 Peter 2:4, the apostle Peter said:
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them into hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment;
After the Lucifer led rebellion, God had to do something with the perfect physical beings that fought for him. Ezekiel 1:4-28 and Revelation 4:6-9 speaks of unidentified “living creatures” working for God and in Heaven. These unidentified “living creatures” could be the perfect physical creatures that fought for God during the Pre-Adamic war.

The Bible speaks of unidentified “creatures.”
Ezekiel 1:4-28
I looked, and I saw a windstorm coming out of the north--an immense cloud with flashing lightning and surrounded by brilliant light. The center of the fire looked like glowing metal, and in the fire was what looked like four living creatures. In appearance their form was that of a man, but each of them had four faces and four wings. Their legs were straight; their feet were like those of a calf and gleamed like burnished bronze. Under their wings on their four sides were they had the hands of a man. All four of them had faces and wings, and their wings touched one another. Each one went straight ahead; they did not turn as they moved.

Their faces looked like this: Each of the four had the face of a man, and on the right side each had the face of a lion, and on the left the face of an ox; each also had the face of an eagle. Such were their faces. Their wings were spread out upward; each had two wings, one touching the wing of another creature on either side, and two wings covering its body. Each one went straight ahead. Wherever the spirit would go, they would go, without turning as they went. The appearance of the living creatures was like burning coals of fire or like torches. Fire moved back and forth among the creatures; it was bright, and lightening flashed on it. The creatures sped back and forth like flashes of lightening.

As I looked at the living creatures, I saw a wheel on the ground beside each creature with its four faces. This was the appearance and structure of the wheels: They sparkled like chrysolite, and all four looked alike. Each appeared to be made like a wheel intersecting a wheel. As they moved, they would go in any one of the four directions the creatures faced; the wheels did not turn about as the creatures went. Their rims were high and awesome, and all four rims were full of eyes all around.

When the living creatures moved, the wheels beside them moved; and when the living creatures rose from the ground, the wheels also rose. Wherever the spirit would go, they would go, and the wheels would rise along with them, because the spirit of the living creatures was in the wheel. When the creatures moved, they also moved; when the creatures stood still, they also stood still; and when the creatures rose from the ground, the wheels rose along with them, because the spirit of the living creatures was in the wheels.

Spread out above the heads of the living creatures was what looked like an expanse, sparking like ice and awesome. Under the expanse their wings were stretched out one towards the other, and each had two wings covering its body. When the creatures moved, I heard the sound of their wings, like the roar of rushing waters, like the voice of the Almighty, like the tumult of an army. When they stood still, they lowered their wings.

Then there came a voice from above the expanse over their heads as they stood with lowered wings. Above the expanse over their heads was what looked like a throne of sapphire, and high above on the throne was a figure like that of a man. I saw that from what appeared to be his waist up he looked like glowing metal, as if full of fire, and that from there down he looked like fire; and brilliant light surrounded him. Like the appearance of a rainbow in the clouds on a rainy day, so was the radiance around him.

This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the LORD. When I saw it, I fell face down, and I heard the voice of one speaking.
Ezekiel 1
5 The center of the fire looked like glowing metal, and in the fire was what looked like four living creatures.
Chay
Strong's Number: 02416
Original WordWord Origin
yxfrom (02421)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
ChayTWOT - 644a
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
khah'-ee
Definition
adj
  1. living, alive
    1. green (of vegetation)
    2. flowing, fresh (of water)
    3. lively, active (of man)
    4. reviving (of the springtime) n m
  2. relatives
  3. life (abstract emphatic)
    1. life
    2. sustenance, maintenance n f
  4. living thing, animal
    1. animal
    2. life
    3. appetite
    4. revival, renewal
  5. community
Strong's Number: 02416; from 02421; TWOT: 644a
adj
1. living, alive
a. green (of vegetation)
b. flowing, fresh (of water)
c. lively, active (of man)
d. reviving (of the springtime) n m​
2. relatives
3. life (abstract emphatic)
a. life
b. sustenance, maintenance n f​
4. living thing, animal
a. animal
b. life
c. appetite
d. revival, renewal​
5. community
Here are examples of how the word is used in the Bible. They all show living flesh.
Genesis 1:20
And God said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky.
Genesis 1:24
And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so.
Genesis 6
19 You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you.
Genesis 8
21 The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma and said in his heart: "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.
As more proof:
Ezekiel 1
11 Such were their faces. Their wings were spread out upward; each had two wings, one touching the wing of another creature on either side, and two wings covering its body.
G@viyah
Strong's Number: 01472
Original WordWord Origin
hywgprolonged for (01465)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
G@viyahTWOT - 326d
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
ghev-ee-yaw' Noun Feminine
Definition
1) a body (of living creatures)
2) a corpse, carcass, dead body
According to Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, Tenth Edition:
"Body:
(1): (a): the main part of a plant or animal body esp. as distinguished from limb or head: TRUNK . . .
(2): (a): the organized physical substance of an animal or plant either living or dead . . .
(3): (a): a mass of matter distinct from other masses (b): something that embodies or gives concrete reality to a thing; also: a sensible object in physical space . . ."​
The Bible clearly states the Living Creatures/Being are flesh and blood
Revelation 4: 6-9
In the center, around the throne, were four living creatures, and they were covered with eyes, in front and in back. The first living creature was like a lion, the second like an ox, the third had a face like a man, the fourth was like a flying eagle. Each of the four living creatures had six wings and was covered with eyes all around, even under its wings. Day and night they never stop saying:
Holy, holy, holy
is the Lord God Almighty,
who was, and is, and is to come.​

Whenever the living creatures give glory, honor and thanks to him who sits on the throne and who lives for ever and ever, the twenty-four elders fall down before him who sits on the thrown, and worship him who lives for ever and ever.
These “creatures” seen in Heaven are never called angels. “Living creatures” means possessing blood by definition. They are flesh and blood.

Even scripture differentiates between these two groups.
Revelation 7
11 All the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures.
Revelation 4
6 In the center, around the throne, were four living creatures, and they were covered with eyes, in front and in back.
Zoon
Strong's Number: 2226
Original WordWord Origin
zw/'onof a derivative of (2198)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
Zoon2:873,290
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
dzo'-on Noun Neuter
Definition
1. a living being
2. an animal, brute, beast
God had to do something with the perfect physical beings [“enemies” in Jeremiah 4:23] that rebelled against him and along with Lucifer. Certain “evil spirits,” or “demons,” roam around without any sort of physical body. These evil spirits, which are not called evil angels in scripture, are the disembodied spirits of the perfect physical beings that rebelled against God and were killed in his wrath.

In Mark 1:21-26, an evil spirit, or demon, tried to expose Jesus and who he really was before the proper time. The text says, "They went to Capernum, and when the Sabbath came, Jesus went into the synagogue and began to teach. The people were amazed at his teaching, because he taught them as one who had authority, not as the teachers of the law. Just then a man in their synagogue who was possessed by an evil spirit cried out, 'What do you want with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are--the Holy One of God!'

'Be quiet!' said Jesus sternly. 'Come out of him!' The evil spirit shook the man violently and come out of him with a shriek."

Mark 5:1-13 says, "They went across the lake to the region of the Gerasenes. When Jesus got out of the boat, a man with an evil spirit came from the tombs to meet him. This man lived in the tombs, and no one could bind him any more, not even with a chain. For he had often been chained hand and foot, but he tore the chains apart and broke the irons on his feet. No one was strong enough to subdue him. Night and day among the tombs and in the hills he would cry out and cut himself with stones.

When he saw Jesus from the distance, he ran and fell on his knees in front of him. He shouted at the top of his voice, 'What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? Swear to God that you won't torture me!' For Jesus was saying to him, 'Come out of this man, you evil spirit!'

Then Jesus asked him, 'What is your name?'

'My name is Legion,' he replied, 'for we are many.' And he begged Jesus again and again not to send them out of the area.

A large herd of pigs was feeding on the nearby hillside. The demons begged Jesus, 'Send us among the pigs; allow us to go into them.' He gave them permission, and the evil spirits came out and went into the pigs. The herd, about two thousand in number, rushed down the steep bank into the lake and were drowned."

Thus ends the saga of Pre-Adamic creation and war.

Many question the context of Ezekiel 28:12-19 because in Ezekiel 28:13 it mentions Lucifer [Satan] being in the Garden of Eden after he was identified and described as being perfect and flawless, as in before his commission of sins and rebellion. Therefore, by that argument, Ezekiel 28:12-19 must refer to Lucifer’s fall as happening during or after the existence of the Garden of Eden.

However, this is a faulty assertion because:

1) Genesis 3 points out Satan’s [Lucifer’s] presence in the Garden of Eden in the capacity of a deceiver and enemy of God. This means Satan already rebelled against God and left his original place in Heaven.

2) This argument neglects the fact that Satan and his angels are cast down and hit the earth and God follows and directs his wrath to the Earth. Such events cannot go unnoticed, and nowhere during or after the existence of the Garden of Eden is either massively destructive event accounted for.

3) Ezekiel 28:18 mentions “sanctuaries” that Lucifer [Satan] had. He definitely could have had sanctuaries during the original creation, but there is no record or existence of any sanctuaries for Satan [fallen Lucifer] in this Adamic remake of the heavens and the earth. Further, if Satan [fallen Lucifer] is the enemy of God, clear and academic logic says that God would not give him any “sanctuaries.”

4) The Garden of Eden spoken of in Ezekiel 28:13 is the original Garden of Eden on the original earth.

Closing Comments

Many assert the war in Heaven in Revelation 12:7-9 is not a past event, but a future prophetic event. However, this creates the following problems:

1) Jude 1:6 and 2 Peter 2:4 state the past tense event of angels leaving heaven and being bound in chains in Hell.
Jude 1
6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home--these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.
2 Peter 2
4For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them into hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment;
If the angels that followed Lucifer [Satan] are already absent from Heaven and imprisoned in Hell, then Satan has no army to initiate another war in Heaven. The angels that fought against Lucifer and the angels that followed him made their free will choice to stay with and fight for God. Further, these past tense verses are self-evident that a rebellion has already taken place.

2) Genesis 3 and Ezekiel 28:12-19 point out Satan’s [Lucifer’s] presence in the Garden of Eden in the capacity of a deceiver and enemy of God. This means Satan already rebelled against God and left his original place in Heaven.

3) The content of Revelation 12:10-13 speaks of a future event independent from the past war in Heaven spoken of in Revelation 12:7-9.
Revelation 12
10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say: "Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Christ. For the accuser of our brothers, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down.
11 They overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death.
12 Therefore rejoice, you heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you! He is filled with fury, because he knows that his time is short."
13 When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child.
In verse 10, Satan [Lucifer] is identified as accusing the brethren, a role fulfilled by an enemy of God. This would indicate Satan has already rebelled. Further, verse 11 specifies the “brothers” as the church by having “possessed” the “blood of the Lamb,” which is Christ’s blood.

The major key then lies in verse 13, where only the dragon [Satan] is identified as being hurled down by himself, with no accompanying angels with him.

Verse 10 is consistent with Zechariah 3:1-2, Job 1:7-12, and Job 2:1-6, where Satan, as an enemy of God, stood as an accuser before God in Heaven or on earth trying to convict and bring down anyone who follows God. And it is precisely this position [an accusing position in Heaven] that he is expelled from.

Further, note that in Revelation 12:9 Satan is referred to as the “ancient serpent,” whereas Satan is referred to as “the accuser” in Revelation 12:10. This is significant because “ancient” denotes an extremely old identity along with the reference “serpent,” which refers to Satan’s appearance in the Garden of Eden. However, the identity of “the accuser” refers to Satan’s appearances in Old Testament times [accusing Israel] and New Testament times [accusing the brethren in the church]. These roles directly refer to the time related identities of Satan [combined with the fact that Satan is cast down with angels in Revelation 12:9 verses Satan being cast down alone in Revelation 12:10].

Defensive Argumentation

Opponents say, “One of the popular devices for trying to accommodate the evolutionary ages of the geologists and astronomers in the creation record of the Bible has been the "gap theory"—also called the "ruin-and-reconstruction" theory . . . The gap theory was developed mainly for the purpose of accommodating the great ages demanded by evolutionary geologists.” [Quote from Dr. Morris, ICR]

This assertion is flawed because:
1) A perfect creation of God [Deuteronomy 32:4] is perfect as is. It does not require any form of evolution, for all God wanted to achieve was achieved in the one, definitive act of creation [Genesis 1:1]. Evolution “begs the question” of perfection and is a pointless gesture in light of perfection.
2) Pre-Adamic Creation is not defined by those who “believe” in it, but by the solid facts that support it. For instance, the person who first “came up” with Pre-Adamic Creation does not “own” the concept, for this person could have been mistaken in the concept’s composition, supporting “facts,” and application. Instead, the proper and factual version of Pre-Adamic Creation must be tested with debate, intellectually honest examination, and the facts.

Opponents say, “This awesome spectacle of destruction and death was not part of God's ‘very good’ creation. There was no death in the world until sin was in the world (Romans 5:12; I Corinthians 15:21; etc.). In fact, death itself is "the wages of sin" (Romans 6:23).” [Quote from Dr. Morris, ICR]

Genesis 1:31: “God saw all that he had made, and it was very good.”

Consider the following:
1) It says God “made,” not “created.” [SEE GENESIS 1:1 SECTION DEFINITIONS]
2) It says “good,” not perfect. Note the difference in terms. God’s original creation was perfect [Deuteronomy 32:4], but what God made during the six days was “very good” [Genesis 1:31].
3) God’s creation would have remained perfect (not simply “very good”) unless something happened. For instance, God would not have created darkness [1 John 1:5], but somehow it came into existence [Genesis 1:2].
4) In God’s original creation, Lucifer [Ezekiel 28:15-16] and the angels that followed him [Revelation 12:3-4] had brought sin down to the Pre-Adamic Earth [Ezekiel 28:17, Revelation 12:9]. However, during the six days of God’s “making” (reformatting) the heavens and the earth, God placed dominion of the Adamic earth under Adam’s possession. Sin didn’t enter the Adamic Creation until Adam ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil [Genesis 3:6-7].

Opponents say, “But if ‘death reigned’ not ‘from Adam to Moses,’ as the Bible says (Romans 5:14), but had already reigned for billions of years before Adam, then death is not the wages of sin but instead was part of God's creative purpose. How then could the death of Christ put away sin? The gap theory thus undermines the very gospel of our salvation, as well as the holy character of God.” [Quote from Dr. Morris, ICR]

This statement is flawed because:
1) The original perfect physical inhabitants of the earth were a company, not a race. Sin was not being reproduced as a state of being. Therefore, sin (rebelling against God) was purely determined by the individual’s freewill.
2) The original perfect physical inhabitants of the earth were perfect and in full control of their actions, so they were ineligible for and required no grace from God.

Opponents say, “The living creatures were defined as cherubim [Ezekiel 10:20] and Satan is an angel and cherub [Ezekiel 28:14], therefore the living creatures were angels, not Pre-Adamic beings.”

Not true. Consider the following:
K@ruwb
Strong's Number: 03742
Original WordWord Origin
bwrkof uncertain derivation
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
K@ruwbTWOT - 1036
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
ker-oob' Noun Masculine
Definition
1. cherub, cherubim (pl)
a. an angelic being
1. as guardians of Eden
2. as flanking God's throne
3. as an image form hovering over the Ark of the Covenant
4. as the chariot of Jehovah (fig.)
I find it odd that the word "cherub" [K@ruwb] [bwrk] has an "uncertain derivation," but yet it is defined as "an angelic being."

The definition of "cherub" had been commonly assumed to mean "a type of angelic being within a hierarchical order," but the Bible contains no support for that notion. Scholars agree on that point.

To make matters worse, different people argue different word origins from different languages, thus making the "uncertain derivation" a ticket to legitimizing one's personal definition of "cherub."

Consider the facts in scripture:
1) "Cherub" [pl. "Cherubim"] is never defined as an order of angelic beings. Angels can be "cherubs" [Ezekiel 28:14], but "cherubs" are not scripturally restricted to being an inherent angelic role, as in a class/order of angelic beings.

2) "Cherubs" are always shown to be accomplishing roles of guardianship in the context of scripture.
Genesis 3
24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.
Guarding the Garden of Eden.
1 Samuel 4
4 So the people sent men to Shiloh, and they brought back the Ark of the Covenant of the LORD Almighty, who is enthroned between the cherubim.
Guarding God's thrown.
1 Chronicles 13
6 David and all the Israelites with him went to Baalah of Judah (Kiriath Jearim) to bring up from there the ark of God the LORD, who is enthroned between the cherubim--the ark that is called by the Name.
Guarding God's thrown.
Psalm 18
10 He mounted the cherubim and flew; he soared on the wings of the wind.
Escorting God as he moved.
Psalm 99
1 The LORD reigns, let the nations tremble; he sits enthroned between the cherubim, let the earth shake.
Guarding God's thrown.
Isaiah 37
16 O LORD Almighty, God of Israel, enthroned between the cherubim, you alone are God over all the kingdoms of the earth. You have made heaven and earth.
Guarding God's thrown.
Ezekiel 9
3 Now the glory of the God of Israel went up from above the cherubim, where it had been, and moved to the threshold of the temple.
Guarding God and the temple.
Ezekiel 10
1 I looked, and I saw the likeness of a throne of sapphire above the expanse that was over the heads of the cherubim.
Guarding God's thrown.
Ez10
4 Then the glory of the LORD rose from above the cherubim and moved to the threshold of the temple. The cloud filled the temple, and the court was full of the radiance of the glory of the LORD.
Guarding God and the temple.]
Ezekiel 28
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub, for so I ordained you. You were on the holy mount of God; you walked among the fiery stones.

16 Through your widespread trade you were filled with violence, and you sinned. So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God, and I expelled you, O guardian cherub, from among the fiery stones.
Guardian of God's thrown.

The context is clearly and plainly providing a uniform definition/understanding of "cherub" as a guardian.
 
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revcheleven

New Member
Do you believe the Earth is approximately 6,000 years old?
The Bible does not state the Earth is thousands of years old.
Evidently you don't.

Do you believe the Earth is 4.54 Billion years old as per man's estimates according to Geologists/Cosmologists?
....if yes then....
Do you believe that beings lived on Earth prior to Adam?
 

CoreIssue

Administrator
Staff member
Why are you asking questions that are already answered in the post you are responding to?

Challenge anything you wish, but make sure you don't try to use your opinions as proof. Deal with the supporting evidence as well.
 

revcheleven

New Member
The bible's chronology is clearly marked out from Adam to Christ and well supported by Bishop Ussher's Timeline as seen at the following link http://bit.ly/tq8dRm. The Earth is just over 6,000 years old. No one lived on Earth prior to Adam and there is not one verse to directly support otherwise. Genesis 1v1&2 are part of the first day noted at the end of verse 5 any other interpretation is going beyond what God intended by the simple reading of the text. All that you have proposed is counter-factual. The idea of Pre-Adamic is pure fantasy. If you are going to believe in something at least have a direct verse from the bible stating the case.
 

CoreIssue

Administrator
Staff member
I provided verses, word definitions, etc proving my point. You have done nothing but make a doctrinal claim.

How about telling us why verses laid out talking about such a past time where there was no life on the earth are false? After all, even during the flood and immediately after there was life.

If you are going to believe in something at least have a direct verse from the bible stating the case.
This kind of argument is absurd and is a negative proof demand.

I can play that game as well, give me a verse that directly states the earth is 6,000 years old.

Please explain away the verses I provided.
 

CTZonEdit

Site Administrator
Staff member
You must show that a man is wrong before you start explaining why he is wrong. The modern method is to assume without discussion that he is wrong and then distract his attention from this (the only real issue) by busily explaining how he became so silly. In the course of the last fifteen years I have found this vice so common that I have had to invent a name for it. I call it “Bulverism.” Some day I am going to write the biography of its imaginary inventor, Ezekiel Bulver, whose destiny was determined at the age of five when he heard his mother say to his father—who had been maintaining that two sides of a triangle were together greater than a third — ”Oh you say that because you are a man.” “At that moment,” E. Bulver assures us, “there flashed across my opening mind the great truth that refutation is no necessary part of argument. Assume that your opponent is wrong, and the world will be at your feet. Attempt to prove that he is wrong or (worse still) try to find out whether he is wrong or right, and the national dynamism of our age will thrust you to the wall.” That is how Bulver became one of the makers of the Twentieth Century.
 

CTZonEdit

Site Administrator
Staff member
The bible's chronology is clearly marked out from Adam to Christ and well supported by Bishop Ussher's Timeline as seen at the following link http://bit.ly/tq8dRm. The Earth is just over 6,000 years old. No one lived on Earth prior to Adam and there is not one verse to directly support otherwise. Genesis 1v1&2 are part of the first day noted at the end of verse 5 any other interpretation is going beyond what God intended by the simple reading of the text. All that you have proposed is counter-factual. The idea of Pre-Adamic is pure fantasy. If you are going to believe in something at least have a direct verse from the bible stating the case.
You made a bunch of claims here with no foundation. Why do you not respond in the same manner that you require of us?

You are making the claim that the earth is 6000 years old. Provide and I quote "a direct verse from the bible stating the case."

You need to deal with the contradiction you now have in how God created the earth to be inhabited yet the earth was created uninhabitable. This should be very easy for you to refute if we are wrong.

We have provided direct verses from the bible stating our case very clearly.
 

revcheleven

New Member
You need to deal with the contradiction you now have in how God created the earth to be inhabited yet the earth was created uninhabitable.
There is no contradiction....The Earth was not habitable until day 3.

Do you seriously believe the Pre-Adamic beings lived in the dark since you believe that Day 1 did not begin until Gen 1v3?
 

CTZonEdit

Site Administrator
Staff member
There is no contradiction....The Earth was not habitable until day 3.

Do you seriously believe the Pre-Adamic beings lived in the dark since you believe that Day 1 did not begin until Gen 1v3?
Psalm 33 is what gives you the contradiction in your beliefs. It says the heavens, earth, and all creation was one singular event and it stood firm.
A dark chaotic ruined mess of Gen 1:2 is not standing firm.
That is your contradiction.

I believe the Pre-Adamics lived on the perfect earth that God commanded into existence by his word alone per Psalm 33.
They were not living in darkness per 1 John 1 since there is no darkness in Him. He has no reason to create darkness.
God is light. God Himself lit His perfect creation in Gen 1:1.

You on the other hand have God who is light, creating darkness. So somehow you have be able to give an answer as to why He would do such a thing since this reveals yet another contradiction in your belief about creation.
 

CoreIssue

Administrator
Staff member
That issue is covered in the thread you will not read. There you will see there was no darkness in Genesis 1:1 and in Eternity on the new earth there will be no darkness again nor sun.

I will post one verse on the subject, read the thread for the rest.
Job 38
“Who shut up the sea behind doors
when it burst forth from the womb,
9 when I made the clouds its garment
and wrapped it in thick darkness,
10 when I fixed limits for it
and set its doors and bars in place,
11 when I said, ‘This far you may come and no farther;
here is where your proud waves halt’?
The earth was just as the New Earth will be. There will be no sun, no seas and no darkness.

Yet again, you refuse to read proofs that what you say is wrong.

That is why I said deal with that one thread first.

When you do, either proving your case or admitting you are wrong, I will unblock this thread for you again.
 
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CTZonEdit

Site Administrator
Staff member
There was no darkness in Gen 1:1. The earth became dark in Gen 1:2.
Why?

Why would the God of Light create any darkness at all in the original creation? What would the perfection in that?
God is perfect, light, love there would be no reason for darkness.
 
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